Hey folks, Harry here... Reading this interview, I still can't believe Beaks was obsessed with asking about the size of Ashton's... "audience" over and over again. He seems really obsessed with Ashton's "audience". Fascinating, first the Rock, now this. Here's Beaks...
So, there’s this foreign journalist at my roundtable who looks like “Killer” Carlson, but talks like Denis Lemieux, and I’m struggling to stifle a laugh as he pesters Ashton Kutcher for his take on Kabbalah, because all I’m hearing is, “Ashton, who own the Chiefs?”
Sometimes, SLAP SHOT-inspired free-association is the only way to make it through a junket where the reporters are on a single-minded quest to get Young Hollywood’s take on Jewish mysticism (to Kutcher’s credit, he handles the question with self-deprecating aplomb), especially when I’m more interested in asking the directors about the extent to which Ray Bradbury influenced their smart, somewhat humorous, but mostly exceedingly dark time-travel film. I mean, I’m pleased as hell that Kutcher’s banging Demi Moore – I’ve been wanting to do that since BLAME IT ON RIO (such stirrings were foreign to me when I first saw PARASITE) – but this isn’t the type of thing we talk about here at AICN. Well, that’s not entirely true. I’m sure Harry and I have talked about banging Demi Moore, but at least we haven’t posted these thoughts on the site. Until now.
Let’s try this again. So, had I been lucky enough to score a one-on-one with Mr. Kutcher, suffice it to say the conversation wouldn’t have dwelled on his difficulties with the tabloid press, or his non-traditional religious proclivities. Of course, I would’ve had to ask him about his gossiped-about removal from Cameron Crowe’s ELIZABETHTOWN, but I’m sure I would’ve received the same, well-rehearsed answer he gave to our roundtable (i.e. he wasn’t fired; rescheduling interfered with his THAT 70’S SHOW shooting schedule). Candor at a roundtable from a major movie star is not something I expect, especially when he’s supposed to be sharing the floor with his co-star, Amy Smart (who fielded maybe two questions in twenty minutes; clearly, she should’ve spent the week before the junket turning up loaded at Hollywood hot spots with Sam Elliott). Besides, the guy’s already given his Rolling Stone interview in, of all places, Rolling Stone. I hate to say it, but he’s gotta be tapped out of bombshell revelations for a good year or two.
Why was I there again?
Oh, right! To chat up Eric Bress and J. Mackye Gruber, the up-and-coming writing-and-directing team behind THE BUTTERFLY EFFECT. Having enjoyed their nastily inventive work on FINAL DESTINATION 2, and their smart, top-to-bottom rewrite on this year’s CELLULAR (buzz has gotten even more positive on this flick since my set visit late last year), I was looking forward to hearing their take on this generally impressive debut feature, which mixes childhood trauma and time travel to frequently entertaining effect. You’ve read Quint’s rave and Capone’s positive review. Now, read about the guys behind this, *gasp*, quality January release.
Here’s the transcript from my roundtable. First question is from none other than our favorite English mangling goaltender himself (“Owns! Owns!).
An interesting subject that we talked with Ashton Kutcher about, and I wonder how you look at it. The fact that you have the main cast is such a tabloid figure now, and you can’t avoid him everywhere you look. Does that help him to be a serious dramatic actor, or does that distract him? Does that distract you as filmmakers?
Gruber: When we first cast him, this whole media craze and everything wasn’t going on. We shot the film not this past summer, but the summer before. This was before any of the stuff which has developed since. So, we didn’t find it distracting while we were shooting. The one day we were shooting this one scene where he comes back to see Kayleigh (Smart) after all these years, and she works at this diner. We saw people outside lining up with beach blankets just to check him out. It was almost like the 4th of July, and I was like, “That’s weird.” Because I wasn’t really watching that much of THAT 70’S SHOW, but these kids were loving it. So, it really didn’t distract us while we were shooting, and even during post.
Did you have him in mind from the beginning?
Gruber: No, we did not. This whole process has been going on for seven years for us.
Bress: So, at first it was Leonardo DiCaprio. (Laughs) You know, “*That’s* the guy we need!” Over time, those actors in that age range that’s appropriate just drastically shifts in a short period of time.
Gruber: When we were trying to figure out when we were going to shoot this, and Ashton’s name came up, and, like I said, when we first heard it, we were like, “No. There’s no way. We’ve been fighting this fight for seven years; this is our baby. There’s no way he’s going to be in this.” We just saw him as that Michael Kelso sort of goofy sort of character that does DUDE, WHERE’S MY CAR, and it just didn’t seem appropriate. But when we went over to his house before a meeting, we didn’t find that guy there. We found a very serious guy who had broken down the script, and had plastered it all over the walls. He had read it forwards and backwards, and his insight into the character was amazing. His questions were smart and intelligent. When we left the house, it was just this complete 180 where we looked at each other, and we were just like, “He’s the guy.”
Do you think the crowd can do that switch? I mean, he’s been in so many comedies like DUDE, WHERE’S MY CAR and the rest. They’re pretty silly. Do you think the audience can (manage that shift)?
Bress: I think there may be some controversy over it. People may want to see him fail; some people will want to see him succeed. But I think it’s inarguable when you leave the theater, having seen it, there’s nobody that can look me in the eye, or anyone else, and say, “No, he can’t act.” He certainly can. I think he’s brilliant at comedy, but I think that his heart really does lie in drama. I think he really eats up deep characters far more than he would just showing up to make a comedy.
Gruber: I think it’s just the opportunities that were given to him before. He was on a sitcom, and he played this goofy character, and he was perfect for romantic comedies – he’s a good looking guy – and he just kind of fit. No one ever gave him the opportunity to do a serious film before. So, that was just kind of the road that he went. He came out to California – I think he was here maybe like a month – and he was nineteen years old, and they’re like, “Do you want to be on THAT 70’S SHOW?” God, that shows his talent right there. How many people get a job coming here in one month? It took us six years to get a paycheck for writing.
Actually, that’s my next question. Do you think now that he’s very famous that that will help your movie?
Gruber: Yeah, I think it broadens our audience. I think a lot of people are going to come to this movie who are fans of Ashton Kutcher, who are maybe going to expect to see one movie, but are going to see something completely different.
Bress: Which is what we’ve always wanted, as you can kind of tell by the movie, is to really catch people off guard and surprise them. Just with the content of this script before Ashton was ever involved. Now, it’s just sort of gravy. You’re going to see this performance out of this guy that I don’t think anyone’s going to expect. Even if you’re like, “Oh, I heard he can act,” when you go through this rollercoaster ride of his journey, you can’t help but totally respect him as a dramatic actor.
Gruber: Also, thank god for LORD OF THE RINGS, which has been really great for helping us promote our movie. So many people come up to us on the street, and say, “I saw your trailer and… Ashton can act!” It’s like it was this amazing thing, like, “Wow, what did you guys do?” But he had it in him all the time. We were able to lead him into the right direction, but he had it within him.
You mentioned six to seven years: what took so long?
Bress: Struggling artists. (Laughs)
Gruber: When we first wrote this, we had something like over sixty meetings in a month and a half. Everyone loved the script, and everyone’s like, “This is a great script, it’s completely original, but it will never get made. And if it gets made, it will never be distributed by a studio. It’s not commercial enough.” We believe something can be different *and* be commercial. I don’t think you have to serve the same old garbage, and then all of a sudden *that’s* commercial. I think people are craving something sort of different. But because of our controversial nature, everyone was sort of freaked out. We had three failed production attempts before, and, for various reasons, it fell apart. It was just this up-and-down rollercoaster, as well as us directing, where everyone was like, “This is just (tough) on subject matter alone. And besides the complicated nature of the script, you guys are newbies. We’re kind of unsure about the material as it is, and you guys are new. What are you going to give us?” So, it was definitely this uphill battle, but thank god they believed in us. We had written another script for New Line (FINAL DESTINATION 2), and they really loved working with us.
What do you think the age group is for this?
Gruber: I think the age group is about 18 to 35. 35 to 40 maybe.
Bress: It’s weird, because my mom is turning sixty soon, and she’s going to love it. (Laughs.) It’s strange; I think THE SIXTH SENSE, which is, in a way, a somewhat similarly themed kind of movie, or the same kind of demographic. I think that tested highest with fourteen year-old boys and sixty year-old women. That’s what we like! (Laughs.)
Can you guys maybe discuss the role Bradbury’s “A Sound of Thunder” played in the inspiration for this script?
Bress: You know what’s funny? This was written, and this girl that I was dating said, “Oh, this is from Bradbury. You know, the butterfly.” And I’m like, “Oh, I thought the butterfly was the whole ‘a butterfly flaps its wings in Texas’.” And she’s like, “Oh, no, I think that came from Bradbury.” So, she faxed me over – actually, this is back in the internet days when everything was online. So, she just grabbed it off the internet and emailed it to me. That was the first time I read it, and that might’ve been three years ago. So, we had written this thing for four years (prior).
Well, I had noticed the Bradbury University banner.
Gruber: Oh, yeah, we had definitely put a little plug in there.
Bress: After we had heard about that, and we had a production designer come up to us and ask us the name of the college. We were just like, “Oh, Bradbury!” Because that’s throwing out props. Not that it was necessarily an inspiration, but I’ve always been a fan of the guy.
What was your inspiration for the story?
Gruber: It just sort of comes down to the fact that everyone has a day that they’d like to live over, and if you could, should you?
Bress: I have one day, from back when I was sixteen years-old, that I thought from the time I was sixteen to the time when I was twenty-one… I’d think about it every day. If only I could go back and change what happened: I would’ve had breakfast a little longer; I would’ve missed that traffic light, or whatever it was.
What happened that day?
Bress: I can’t talk about it. (Laughs.) But then, years passed, and now, if I had gone back and changed that, then this stressful event may not have occurred. If this stressful event didn’t occur, I wouldn’t have gotten Crohn’s Disease. If I didn’t get Crohn’s Disease, I wouldn’t have stayed close to home when I went to college, and I wouldn’t have met this guy Scott who introduced me to him (indicates Gruber) ten years later. So, I wouldn’t be sitting at this table if I could go back in time. So, would I dare risk changing that one day now that it’s fifteen years later, and my life is on a course that I’m very comfortable with? I think everyone’s got a couple of days like that, and that’s what we wanted: for people to sort of examine their own lives and think, “Would I dare go back and actually alter the course of my life? It would mean that my friends and family, kids and wives would be different. That could all vanish.” That’s something to seriously consider, so you can maybe move on and not dwell on that day any longer.
At what point in the process did you guys go, “Okay we want to direct it?”
Gruber: I think it was as soon as the script was finished. Even during the process, we just knew that there was something special there. I remember reading the first draft before we handed it over to Chris Bender, who’s right over there (indeed, Chris is lurking back by the bathroom). We had just started being represented by the company that he was with. I was like, “I know they’re going to hate this decision about wanting to make this movie. They’re going to say no. They’re going to think we’re crazy, because we’re young, and, of course, everyone wants to direct their own stuff, and their job is to steer you clear of that until you build up a reputation where that will be an easier journey.” So, I remember the other people that he was working with when we said, “Yeah, we want to direct it;” they were like, “Are you crazy!?!?” People were just sort of disappointed, and that’s one of the things that held it back for so long.
Did FINAL DESTINATION 2 kind of change the fate of that?
Gruber: A little bit. Yeah, it definitely helped us that we did a good job on the script.
Did you guys do CELLULAR after this?
Gruber: Yeah, we did CELLULAR after we had finished the DVD of BUTTERFLY EFFECT. We had developed such a great rapport with New Line, and they were like, “We’ve got this movie, and it’s going to be made.” We had worked with David Ellis on FINAL DESTINATION 2, and he loved working with us and said, “Hey, guys, you want to do the rewrites on this?” We were like, “Oh, work with you again, Dave? Of course.” It’s such a pleasure.
How do you work as a (directing) team?
Bress: I don’t know how people *don’t* work as a team, to be honest. I know when we started out, I was going to be the guy that worked with the actors, and he was going to be the guy in charge of the visuals and camera and all of that good stuff. I think that we sort of stayed on that path, but he would come up with ideas for actors that were great, and occasionally, if I had a shot – you know, “Ooh, wouldn’t that be cool?” – he’d be receptive to it. But we had worked on this thing for seven years, so we knew what colors the napkins had to be in the restaurant scene. We knew all these nitpicky things that I think are on the commentary track of the DVD.
Gruber: We ramble on and on and on… (Laughs)
Could you guys talk about your writing process? You always hear about writing teams that are at each others’ throats. Some write… one scene, and (the other) looks it over; some write at the same time.
Gruber: For years, especially with this script, we’d be side-by-side. Our whole thing is, like, every time we do a script, we kind of rap out the ideas for maybe a couple of weeks – just sit there and go back and forth. That’s the great thing about working with a partner, because you have a built-in filter process; there’s no such thing ever as writer’s block. Give it five or ten minutes of going back and forth, and we’re going to find a way through that little road block. It’s good to have someone you can bounce ideas off of; it just makes it faster. We’d be side-by-side… acting out the parts inside his apartment. We’d finally act out the scene, and… “Alright, that seems good enough. Let’s put it down on paper.” That’s what we’ve done for years. Only lately, we’ve just been so busy that we’ve been writing separately. But still there’s always that phone, where it’s like, “Hey, I’m kinda stuck on this little part. Can you help me out on it?” It’s worked perfectly. Honestly, I don’t know how to do it otherwise. It just makes it so much more pleasurable.
Bress: Also, we were working, for the first six years that I’d moved to L.A. and he was just getting out of USC… we were really hungry. We would work for over forty hours a week as writers. There’s no paycheck; there was no manager at the time that we started out. We’d be working five, six days a week just in front of the computer, and if some other job came up, we’d grab it and pay our rent. But you have to be motivated, and only because there were two of us, that would make you get out of bed, because I know at 10:00 he’s going to be there. So, I’m going to be working. And if it were just left up to me, it’s so easy to procrastinate. “I’m going to the beach today!” But we got to the point where we didn’t take breaks. Someone would go to the bathroom, and the other one would be like, “What’s he doing in there? Probably reading!”
How long did it take you all together to write this script?
Gruber: Well, we wrote this script, the first sort-of draft, in a month… seven years ago. But since then there’s been so many tweaks and little rewrites that I can’t even necessarily count anymore.
Bress: Writing is rewriting. That’s what I’m getting out of this whole process.
Was the studio changing things?
Gruber: No, the studio picked it up at what you call a “negative pickup”. So, it was already done by a company called Film Engine, and they gave us a lot of creative control. Overall, especially with the material we have inside there, we came away pretty unscathed.
Bress: Yeah, it’s amazing.
Gruber: Especially for first-time filmmakers.
(SPOILER WARNING – DO NOT READ IF YOU CHERISH YOUR BUTTERFLY EFFECT VIRGINITY)
Bress: That could’ve gone a horrible route with a different studio and a different project. There was once a problem with the dog burning, which is a heavy, heavy scene. It was so heavy, and there are a lot of dog lovers over at New Line, it was sort of like, “Why don’t we make it a cat?” (Laughs) We executed it that way, and everyone said, “Okay, go back to the dog.”
Gruber: It wasn’t like we got our jollies off about burning a dog. It just seemed there was such a psychological motivation where it’s like, “Tommy, you took something away from me that I loved; I’m going to take something away from you that you love.” We’re more dog lovers – I like cats, too – but people seem to love dogs more, and we wanted everyone to feel that punch. Also, really fear and hate this kid, someone who’s so psychotic. Because this is the last time we’re going to see him until he’s grown up. We have to fear this kid. And it just seemed, after writing the cat version, everyone was like, “Nope, you’re right. We care more about the dog.”
(SPOILERS OVER. YOUR CHASTITY HAS BEEN PRESERVED.)
This might be a question more for Chris back there, but what is Ashton’s ability to sell the film.
Bender (moving out from his cubby hole): Ashton’s ability to sell a film?
Yeah. How many people can he bring?
Bender: He has a huge audience. He’s a celebrity. You read about him everywhere; you see him everywhere.
But very teen-minded at this point.
Bender: Absolutely. That was one of the challenges we had with bringing him into this movie, and seeing what he’d be able to do, and doing something different. I think what will make it interesting for people who go see the movie is that you’ll be seeing him doing something completely different.
THE BUTTERFLY EFFECT opens this Friday, January 23rd.
Faithfully submitted,
